A long overdue posting of Dr. Peter Payne's response to Ozair on this subject
Dear Ozair,
My name is Dr. Peter Payne. More than three years ago Scott Cherry passed along to me your paper on rape and pedophilia in the Bible. At that time I wrote this letter for you which I asked him to share with you. ...Did he? Either way, he has only now decided to post it here. In two or three parts I will respond to what you have said. What I had to say about point #1 below turned out to be long enough that I decided to send it by itself and send you my responses to the rest of your paper in a couple of subsequent emails. Since your paper focuses on the question of whether the Old Testament condones rape and pedophilia, I won’t respond here to why a good God would at times command the killing of everyone found in a town, and at times command command what initially may seem like genocide. (I could address that topic at another time.) Since early in your paper you raise the question of the character of God in the Old Testament, that is what I will address in this email. In a subsequent piece I will address texts you cite in support of your claim that the OT God condones rape and pedophilia. *All biblical quotations will be from the English Standard Version translation.
A long overdue posting of Claudine's response to Ozair on this subject
Dear Ozair,
My name is Claudine. A long time ago (3½ years!) Scott Cherry shared with me some of his fascinating correspondence with you about a few passages in the Old Testament books of Moses (and the Qur'an) that were stimulating intense discussion. Well, way back then I wrote this letter for you but Scott chose not to post it until now, especially focused on Deuteronomy 22:28-29.[1]
I understand your difficulty with those bible passages because like many, I share in some of your thoughts. I thought that you may like to hear from a Christian woman on the issue of what seemed to you as rape and pedophilia in the Old Testament.
Nothing can be understood if we don’t understand the beginning: In the beginning...God’s creation was perfect, but a big problem happened: Man disobeyed God. Man decided to listen and trust another voice than that of his creator even though God had warned him it would lead to death. Every other problem humanity has ever experienced stems from that.
Including one's own
Violence is a tool. It is not a hammer or screwdriver that goes in your toolbox for everyday use. It is a tool of last resort. It is behind the glass broken only in extreme circumstances. What are the appropriate circumstances? We always want to avoid violence but there are circumstances when violence is necessary.
The Qur'an and hadiths of Islam teach that violence is an appropriate tool for the propagation of religion. In contrast, the Hebrew conquest of Canaan was a period in which God-ordained violence occurred but the purpose of the conquest was not to gain converts. Later, Jesus and the entire New Testament make it very clear that violence must never be a tool for the Church to spread Christianity or the gospel message. This brings us to the question of self-defense.
A Comparative Analysis of Violence in the Sacred Texts and Histories of Christianity and Islam
Reflections on the seminar on February 20, 2016
When is violence justified (if ever)? In this seminar we looked at the Bible's Old Testament as well as the Qur'an in terms of violent actions and violent commands. What are the justifications for violence? Do one or the other sacred texts condone violence? If so, for what reasons? If not, why has violence been part of their history and/or their present? First, Jim Walker examined Islam’s theological basis and scope of application for the use of force to spread Islam’s rule. The statements and teachings found in the Qur'an, hadith, and sira, coupled with actions and events during Muhammad’s life form the basis for this topic. Also, the statement “there is no compulsion in religion” (Qur'an 2:256) was reviewed for its context and scope. Next, Wissam Al-Aethawi covered the Biblical rules of engagement and proper hermeneutics of violent passages in the Old Testament of the Bible, and finally the Great Commission given by Jesus as the New Testament method of spreading the Christian faith. He also addressed implications for Christian self-defense. In the final segment Steve Schlichter with the two presenters facilitated a spirited discussion and analysis of both presentations.
A Post-Seminar Commentary by Presenter Dan Kersey
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Presenters: Dan Kersey and Marc Bayne
This seminar examined the arguments Christians and the Church have relied on in the "gay debate" within our culture. We presented some historical insights into the development of marriage customs from a variety of societies, with a focus on the West and America. Participants discussed and processed the content to identify the apologetics, and the moral/cultural considerations. In our discussion we also considered several Scripture texts to determine and show the Biblical position on homosexual behaviors and/or lifestyles, and how churches and individual Christians should respond accordingly. This topic is also of interest to Muslims because Islam experiences similar cultural currents in the West. |